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Yeah, agreed. And realistically they are correct. I’d argue that “good enough” is how most things are done.

You are not the only one. I also dislike it immensely. For a framework that established itself as "for developers who don't know or want to learn CSS", polluting the HTML in the manner you describe makes no sense. And no company I've worked at figured out how to prevent it from becoming a bloated, impossible-to-maintain mess.

>> Of course, there is indeed no shame. There is also no pride.

I disagree completely. The pride should come from the value that is delivered. Specifically, this:

>> Useful, probably optimal and will be around for decades to come.

Is something to be proud of, full stop.


I think there's something nice about the idea of a store owner which has unnecessarily decorated the store with love, even with the liability of a cat; it's not delivering the product better and the cat may actually make things worse because of allergies.

A cold American convenience store may be delivering the fundamental value at American prices, but there's something to be said about that "extra" human or creative element. One might say the same thing about the changing nature of the web over time, less individual CSS chaos and more Facebook aesthetics.


There's nothing stopping people from decorating their boutique stores (or personal blogs, portfolios, and fan websites) the way they want. And that's fun and delightful for me, as a visitor, just like boutique shops are IRL.

But I really don't need that quirkiness at Home Depot, the DMV or my bank (or Amazon, or government websites, or my banking site). I'm there to purchase some screws, register my car or pick up some checks. I just need a storefront (or a website) that lets me do that as fast and homogenously as possible.

99.9% of stores (and UIs) are the latter, not the former.


There's now an entire cottage industry that is based attempted take-downs or refutations of claims made by AI providers. Lots of people and companies are trying to make a name for themselves, and others are motivated by partisan bias (e.g. they prefer OpenAI models) or just anti-LLM bias. It's wild.

I call it a pro-human bias, personally.

I don't think it's anti-LLM bias--or, if it is, it's ironic, because this post smells a lot like it was written by one.

(BTW, I don't necessarily think LLMs helping to write is a bad thing, in and of itself. It's when you don't validate its output and transform it into your own voice that it's a problem.)


Great, it can compete with the cottage industry dedicated solely to hyping and exaggerating AI performance.

Side note: after drowning in LLM-generated content, it's pretty refreshing to read something written by a human. They're a pretty good writer, too!

Who needs LLM garbage when you have MLM garbage?

>> are we being spammed? great. annoying.

Yeah, very. Every single time this happens here, where there's a thread about an Anthropic model and people spam the comments with how Codex is better, I go and try it by giving the exact same prompt to Codex and Opus and comparing the output. And every single time the result is the same: Opus crushes it and Codex really struggles.

I feel like people like me are being gaslit at this point.


this is exactly how the other side feels


>> for the more than 3 million developers who use it every week

It is instructive that they decided to go with weekly active users as a metric, rather than daily active users.


They (and other AI players) have been using WAU over DAU for all their metrics, and many have questioned why. But if you look at other data sources of AI adoption, the reason is clear: Even while 56% of Americans now "regularly" use GenAI on a weekly basis, a much smaller percentage 10 - 14% use it on a daily basis. Here's one source but others had similar numbers: https://www.genaiadoptiontracker.com/

56% is much more impressive than 14%.

This may look bad until you consider that all of them are already desperately strapped for compute. I think the lower DAU is due to a combination of that and people still figuring out how to use AI.


>> I switched to Codex and found it extremely inferior for my use case.

Yeah, 100% the case for me. I sometimes use it to do adversarial reviews on code that Opus wrote but the stuff it comes back with is total garbage more often than not. It just fabricates reasons as to why the code it's reviewing needs improvement.


That, and also the plumber loses their license. So perhaps the solution is professional licensing for software engineers.

I feel like a licencing process for software engineers would

A) test lots of skills that are common but not universal. I'm thinking javascript trivia here, where I don't write any javascript in my professional capacity as a software engineer; but there are many people who think Software Engineer == Javascript Programmer

B) shine too much of a light on the fact that this industry is full of people who demand high salaries but can't program their way out of a paper bag


I think that's coming regardless. AI just might be the perfect storm to bring the timeline in considerably.

Engineer is a protected title in Canada after all

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